50.110 : the forbiden calling frecuency?

Author Post

Miguel, EA4EOZ

Wed Jul 28 2010, 01:21PM
Is it just my impression or 50.110 is becoming the forbiden calling frecuency?

Time ago standing on 50110 was a nice way to see if band opens just because people used it to make calls. Just what a calling frequency is supossed to be.

But lately, specially this year, standing on 50110 seems to be just a waste of time. (Almost) nobody use it. It is much better to stand on 50115, 50120 or better 50150 to see if band is open. I'm not talking about EU stations. Even when a transatlantic or TEP opening starts, people prefers to call around 50080-50090 or around 50120-50125.

So unless you have Internet connection (cluster, on4kst chat, etc) you will miss all openings, except if you are moving your dial constantly looking for weak signals. I think we are creating Internet dependency to all 6m operators.

So, I wonder if the "strict" rules about 50.110 usage are a good idea or not.

73!
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Per, LA7DFA
Thu Jul 29 2010, 11:00AM
Per, LA7DFA
Registered Member #189
Joined: Sun Apr 06 2008, 04:05PM

Posts: 44
It would be better to call it activity centre, than calling frequency. The internet manages DX to be discovered in other ways. By keeping the "rules" from the past, we only make sure there will be a lot of grumpy people complaining about EU in the DX window.
Its plain stupid that anyone in South Eu can work North Africa on 50.110, while JW/JX/SCA cannot work LZ on same QRG....
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Ian, G6TGO
Mon Aug 02 2010, 03:05PM
Ian, G6TGO
Registered Member #170
Joined: Sat Apr 05 2008, 12:42PM

Posts: 20
Hello Guys.I feel a joint discussion on this very subject at the IARU regions at the next meetings may need to come up with a up to date and uniform dedicated Domestic and International Calling Frequency for SSB ops World wide, as most countries licencing conditions have changed in the last few year's.Here in the UK we use the centre of activity allocation as per bandplan but most use it for Domestic calling 50.150 and we get comments 'please clear the calling frequency' when on 150! and even abuse when the band has not been open!I have noticed Italy uses 145 for its internal domestic calls and Spain use 50.140 the Swiss seem to favour 50.160 or 165, the US uses 125 as their Domestic calling freq hi!So I am in full support of the need a more uniformed structure.73 de Ian G6tgo. IO83.
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Miguel, EA4EOZ
Mon Aug 02 2010, 03:45PM
Miguel, EA4EOZ
Registered Member #1229
Joined: Tue Mar 23 2010, 01:26PM

Posts: 5
Ian, G6TGO wrote ...

I have noticed Italy uses 145 for its internal domestic calls and Spain use 50.140


This is the first time I hear this...

My post was in the way when you are portable somewhere, or do not have internet connection to run ON4KST or cluster access, you are lost because nobody call on the calling frequency, so you need to constantly move your dial for hours and hours to find callers.

50MHz can't be worked today without an Internet connection. Just my point of view.

73!
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Ken, G4IGO
Wed Aug 04 2010, 11:20AM
Ken, G4IGO
Registered Member #31
Joined: Tue Mar 18 2008, 08:16PM

Posts: 62
Re 110 – the calling frequency.
As Miguel says - that is what a calling frequency is set up to be - a place where people can call CQ, on a dead or alive band to look for stations – OUTSIDE of the continent they are in – but see below. So – you get a reply ( from a different continent) – OK – you have no idea how long the band will stay open so you make a quick qso – no problem – but now what – well that depends. Either you qsy and the DX now calls CQ – or vice versa – but the general rule is that the person who was on the qrg first has right of way. OK – so more DX from another continent calls – now best practice says that you should qsy as you are now making qso’s on the calling qrg – fair enough. What should NOT happen is that the band police get on your back, nor should others call over you (but the general rule is that the person who was on the qrg first has right of way) – they are well out of order.
The DX station, if it stays on 110 should also qsy as soon as it is clear the band is open wider.
Now – what happens if you call CQ and you get a reply from your own continent? (see below)
Well bluntly you should politely tell the other station to standby while you CQ for DX outside your continent, and if after a little time you get not replies qsy up the band and qso the caller. If they persist then they are bluntly being rude.
Direction CQ’s are also a good idea (CQ DX South America – implies I only want South America to reply).
One problem is that a lot of people call 50110 the “DX calling frequency” – well that creates the problem – it is NOT – it is the “INTERCONTINENTAL calling frequency” Also what is DX? – that is different for every one of us!
I have just checked – in fact RSGB and IARU do call 50110 “DX calling”
IARU says “c. The International DX calling frequency 50.110 MHz should not be used for calling within the European part of Region 1 at any time.” But in the IARU VHF Managers Handbook it states “The intercontinental DX calling frequency 50110 should not be used for calling within the European part of region 1 at any time”
RSGB say “Note 2. No QSO’s on this frequency. Always QSY when working intercontinental DX.”
As can be seen even IARU says different things!!
Perhaps this should be rewritten to “INTERCONTINENTAL CALLING” as clearly as it is now gives rise to different interpretations!!! But what if it is changed to INTERNATIAONAL CALLING??? – that means it fine for I to work G, DL, YU, W, JA etc all on the same qrg!! – maybe that’s what some people are doing…………
Re Per’s point – S EU to North Africa is OK – but what is EU – is 4X in EU? is 5B in EU? Is TA in EU? Is TF in EU?????? Where do we set the lines!!
Miguel’s observations are correct – the main reason is that a lot of stations – mainly all over EU and Carib tend not to follow the above – they sit on 110. – and in EU if there is E’s and /or backscatter the DX is hidden under the pile – so yes – people qsy to a “clear” qrg – sensible I think – but that doesn’t defeat the purpose of 110.
We should also bear in mind that there is an increasing problem in that those that are on the chat tend to use other qrg’s agreed with other stations on the chat so don’t call cq on 110 – for the reasons above. This gives a bigger problem in that only a very small number of people use the chats – so are unaware of what is going on – so in actual fact the chances for qso’s on and band that may only be marginally open are decreasing. People seem to be setting up their own”dx calling” qrg – personally I have mixed views – but I do understand why.
RE 50150 – many years ago when the UKSMG started I did a survey of which the outcome was that it was felt that 50150 should be used in EU as a calling qrg – in the main this still occurs and is used by those who know about it –this will explain why 50150 is used today. Personally I don’t see other “local” calling/activity qrg’s – but surely that isn’t a problem if others wish to do that?
I agree with Miguel re “internet dependency”
Per also mentions the “Internet” – please remember that, IMHO, The users that are on the Inet are very few in comparison to the Amateur population as a whole – so lets not lose sight of that – we are the minority and should leave the rules as they are and not change them to suite the minority.
DX windows are a different thing but as with all the above are fine IF people keep to the rules in the main. IMHO they should be kept – contests etc NOT in them.
”Domestic” calling / activity qrg’s are fine – just as long as they don’t infringe on the agreed ones.
A centre of activity IS different from a calling qrg – again the problem is lack of education, incorrect information and bluntly rudeness / policemen.
Most of the problems nowadays are nothing to do with the agreed qrg’s / designations etc.
They are IMHO due to us –the users. Some of us think we know it all and try to impinge our views on the rest, some of us are bluntly rude, some of us don’t know about the band plans etc. There is also, in my view, an unhealthy situation that several who have posted have hit on - the Internet / chats. Also – as above the situation re 110 is muddy – so causes problems as well.
There is an arrogance now that those on the Inet / chat /cluster know it all and that any body else is a lid etc – those of us that have this facility should remember that we are only a drop in the ocean. Remember how many qso’s E4X had in EU – and how many of those stations were on the chat / Cluster – very few of them.
Miguel’s last point is the one we should all take note of.
We should bear in mind that most of the users have no idea of band plans, don’t belong to any groups or societies etc so wont be as “educated” as those of us that are.
As long as we follow the “rules” as much as we can, be polite, NOT be rude or arrogant, and educate where possible we shouldn’t have a big problem – WE make our own problems Gentlemen – IMHO.
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Peter, PA2V
Mon Aug 09 2010, 09:15AM
Peter, PA2V
Registered Member #76
Joined: Fri Mar 21 2008, 04:20PM

Posts: 21
When I started in 1988 on 6M we had no internet. I finally discovered the DXcluster in 1997. Did I missed a lot of DX?
No. Together with friends on 6M, monitoring indicators, a lot of listening on the band and a few calls on 110 did the job. AND.... it was fun! Nowadays I am a ON4KST user. Sometimes I feel I do depend on the internet. But this season it showed again that these old operating practice does the job. This year I am very restricted in time. And I can't wait 5 minutes to have the PC on air. Dialing and monitoring sure did do the job again. So don't feel bad using 110. It is not that strickt. And aren't we all radio-amateurs? Regards, Peter
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